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This is what I hate perhaps most about recent arguments. And not just because I’m a white cis straight male from well-enough family in mostly problem-free country and thus should have absolutely nothing to say about anyone’s problems ever anywhere…

But yeah, a tad bit because of exactly that. I too have a brain. I too can think and put myself in the position of another.

And no, I cannot say I know perfectly well what you’ve been through and how you feel, though surprisingly pain and suffering does not change depending on where it comes from. You still hurt and you still feel fear, loss and misery. The amount of it changes and that is the hard part to understand, but it’s still possible.

A person. Can. Understand. A. PLENTY!

And if you’re full of shit and somebody calls you out on it, it doesn’t matter how much you’ve been through or who you are or who they are, they still might be right.

Also notice that I didn’t say “they are right”. They could be full of sheit too, but you should at least take a moment to reflect that you’re doing the right too, no matter the pain and suffering.

When all you’ve ever known is pain, loss and hate… It’s damn easy to just give the exact same forward as well.

Well to be clear there’s still quite a lot of a difference between a privileged person telling a disenfranchised class that they understand them when they may fundamentally not understand them and a frustrated sassy sphinx telling a sad confused dragon that she understands dragons, lol

Well, in this case she’s both being aggressive about it AND she’s more privileged. In a way, as many problems as she’s had, hers have been the kind of problems some sort of Cryptid Secret Princess would have (including the kidnapping part), while the dragons have been living in literal metaphysically imposed misery. The thing is, that’s compensated by the fact that she was the one in mortal danger all along this trip, so even if that she thinks she understands isn’t what’s actually there to understand, the angry response would be perfectly understandable. Plus there’s also the chance she does understand, that she sees through the pattern of abuse, although I don’t know what experience she has to pick on that.

That being said, I think anyone claiming to understand an “Alien Other” is overstepping their boundaries. But I agree that when someone who’s vastly more privileged says it, and especially if they say it in a condescending way, that’s quite the compounding on the slap.

Aye. This has surprisingly lot similarities to many a conversations seen these days.

And by far I don’t claim understanding a person, who comes from, is living in or is coming to face circumstances that differ vastly from which you come from, live in or will probably ever come to face, is ever easy. It’s hard enough to understand people who live next door many a times. Even they live lives greatly different than you. But by jove we are all people at the end of the day.

In that regard KoryBing is indeed right that we are not dragons and sphinxes. We are all human. No matter how you look or where you come from or what you feel deep inside. And humans are relatable to humans. Even if it comes with some difficulty. And people can understand a plenty of what’s going on with a person, even if they haven’t lived the exact same circumstances as they have. Even if they disagree with the other.

Buuuuut… I’m kinda also expecting Michelle to masterfully display how she actually does not understand the situation with Bloodcarver and friends… She has a bit of tendency of blowing up under pressure… But we’ll have to see. I hope she does get it right and Bloodcarver is willing to listen. He has at least given her the benefit of doubt. Even over his father and savior. That’s huge when it comes to things like this.

What’s hard about it?
Here are things anybody can understand, no ambiguity about them.
1. I trusted you, to some extent, not to endanger me.
2. I was in mortal danger here and still am.
3. Trying to tell me that the people trying to kill me are usually nice, isn’t helping.

That’s pretty goddamn elemental, that’s not something someone has to come from a position of privilege or lack of privilege to get. There is no subtlety or nuance there that’s okay if you’re not privileged or forbidden if you are. Those are cold facts and Michelle’s in a hot temper. She does not misunderstand a single thing about that.

But that’s not what Bloodcarver is referring to when he says “you don’t understand”. Of course she understands HER situation, but he’s telling her she doesn’t understand his, which, well, he doesn’t really seem to either, but it may or may not be true for her too.

Not that it matters all that much while still in mortal danger, true, but that makes the whole conversadtion out of place anyway, though still plenty plausible.

I’m seeing battered individual syndrome here. ‘They’re not usually like this!’, ‘It must have been something I did to set them off this time.’, ‘They really are a nice person..’

It’s not Bc’s fault as when you live with such an individual, you learn their habits and times when they give even the slightest of praise you feel proud and happy that for once, they are not hitting you. That even the most casual of anything that isn’t violence (verbal abuse included) towards you is considered a good day. Over time that becomes the normal and if they lash out, the first go to is ‘I did something wrong’ because each time they got angry before they blamed you, no matter how trivial it was or if it was their fault to begin with. So you tell yourself that they are angry now, so you must have done something.

It makes me as sad as much as upset to see it. Because I was in that kind of place for years. I recognize it now for what it is.

Oh blood.. honey… You have been around Dis Pater far far too long. We need to get you out of this situation so bad. You have been abused by them so badly.

Having been in an abusive relationship myself. You really don’t know that its abusive till your out of it. and able to reflect back on it with a fresh set of eyes. knowing how things can be better. Probably why I feel so badly for Bloodcarver. Relate with them so badly. I want him to be happy…

It’s worse for Bloodcarver because he *has* had a brief taste of that ‘better life’ but bears so much responsibility for the rest of his kind, and can’t convince them. If he’s going to break out of this abusive cycle, he’s got to do it alone – he’s not going to be able or allowed to take anyone with him and the choice may utterly destroy him inside… if his actions haven’t determined the ‘choice’ for him already.

And now we get to see what the ‘Obverse And Reverse’ title really means. Two sides of the same coin; both Michelle and Bloodcarver will be ‘alone’ in the world, cut off from what remains of their kind, and nobody to depend upon who truly understands the other’s position than each other.

While this looks like denial on Blood’s part, has *anyone* considered the possibility that Dis Pater isn’t really like this? Consider where they are — they are in a realm of *demons*. What are demons capable of doing?

Possession of other beings.

Just some food for thought.

Huh! You’re right I did NOT consider that! It does sound plausible — except, if this were truly an unprecedented swerve into cray-cray territory, wouldn’t other dragons have been nonplussed at his behavior? Instead of largely taking everything in stride? When he brutally attacked Bloodcarver for /daring to attempt a rational discussion/ they didn’t go “oh, no! Papa, what are you doing, this isn’t like you!”, it looked like business as usual to them.

So the possession would have to have happened LONG ago… So long ago that the possessed behavior is considered his normal one. In which case “he’s not like that” doesn’t make sense either and is still denial.

Just for the sake of argument, I’d imagine that Pater would have been under possession for a long period of time. However, I don’t imagine that his behavior would have changed all that much — until the time to do so would have suited the demons.

As for the other dragons speaking out, they seem a rather timid bunch, and until the promises of power were made, they seem to be very obedient and fearful beings. For what it’s worth the green lindwurm seemed apprehensive and concerned during points of these exchanges. Perhaps Pater’s outburst at this time was out of the ordinary.

What if he’d been possessed for all this time and he’s only now just been released from the demon’s grip? Imagine him being asleep for so long, possibly even half-aware of raising the orphaned survivors of his kind, only to wake up to find himself facing a member of the race responsible(even if indirectly). Learning that the centuries-long nightmare was historical fact.

It looks like medallions have their power siphoned off in Dis as well.

Hmmm. seems to me I’ve seen this scenario a time or two… dozen? But never with a giant red Dragon and a snarky Sphinx in Dis. That’s certainly new.

Poor Bloodcarver is having problems with his programming. He seems like a nice guy, otherwise he wouldn’t be having problems with his programming. His name really doesn’t suit him, though. I’m betting Michelle will shorten it to BC before this is all over.

“I understand that you got duped by your abusive, manipulative boss into bringing me here under the assumption that he’d do the right thing for his people and get them out of this literal, actual hellhole. But that’s not what happened, is it? Nooo! Turns out your oh-so-great leader is nursing a centuries-old grudge that he holds higher than his entire species, and he made some cockamamie deal with a bunch of demons to turn me into a giant, fuzzy Duracell! Honestly, I’m having a hard time deciding which of us is having the worse day. Me for being here or you for finding out you’ve spent your life working for a selfish, scaly asshat!”

I see the floss bobbins! Is it embroidery floss? Or can I get a skein on one?

How is body dysphoria because of medallion treated in this world?

like a non human looking at themself in a mirror showing a human form and it feeling off to the point where the non-human would want to avoid turning as much as possible or completely stop using their medallion

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